CHOSENMAN007

Steve only telling you the truth. Those are the temps. U can show me graphs and pie charts ain't gona change a thing ; )

Well as you know the remap and rolling road is booked so I can show you that data after that, but for the mo the data I have is the readings myself and Rob have on charge temp and as you know the point at which timing pull occurs, obviously without being on the rolling road we dont know the exact amount of bhp we loose, but I'm sure you agree any timing pull will result in a loss of bhp.

There has already been proven problem with myself and Rob hitting charge temps that cause timing pull meaning we are losing power and the car is having to take action to avoid DET, I'm sure if more monitored their intake temps they would also be seeing this problem, yes while it's not drastic and the car 'deals' with it, lets face it timing pull is not ideal and perfect, the Water/meth is keeping me under and well away from this happening (that's oour engine taking advantage right there). Meaning while having a blast with each other I would have the advantage of no timing pull, the bonus will be to see if Mark can then take advantage even more.

Jay of course its better, a colder charge is better, everyone knows this, otherwise is a hotter charge better, of course not, it's safer to be cooler, more oxygen rich and dense, making the engine even more det safer keeping away from timing pull, if it's not better why have the laminova, why have front mount intercoolers, why have timing retard if temps are high.

Ermm 1st question has been answered way above. If you google methanol injection science will say cooler is better. FACT! IAT is after the where the water/meth is injected. So its real world data. Paper data as I've stated numerous times is to follow.

I know myself and rob don't have any issues with oil temps even when rob hits 129 on track. Reason being we are using millers nano drive triple ester racing oil which is rated to 125-150 degree temps. Yes cooler is better but as it is we are good. Today I hit a average iat temp of 28-33 degrees in normal driving. That's with meth on constantly. Without its 48-54 degrees. Massive difference. Just a point to note.

Sorry I think you miss understood me, I didn't mean they were necessary beneficial, but the engines are quite happy in those countries and developed for it. Even so minus 100 is a dam site colder than water/meth. Jay it runs 80-90 under general driving which is perfect, but under heavy hard pulls/spirit driving hits 110 hence the comment about the oil cooler, but again this is off subject on oil and engine not charge temps and water/meth.

Yep I found out it’s been around for years, wish I knew sooner, hate to think what else is out there. I don’t know why we keep focusing on this to cold oil temp and engine/block temp, it’s not going to happen from water/meth, My oil temps are a good 110 degrees without going on track so any reduction I do get (seen 5 degrees) is going to help, I need it down more anyways so going to add a oil cooler ready for track. Even with water/meth we aren’t going to see IAT’s that are going to be an issue. Nitrous is minus 200 degrees far colder than water/meth, don’t tell me I can’t use that also?

Well my effects so far on temps are posted on the previous page with more adjustment coming and final results to come from my visit to Mark. You say adoption is relatively low, yet there are loads of companies (aem,snow, Devilsown, Aquamist, Alkysystems, Coolingmist) to name a few, employing hundreds of people which means there is obviously a massive market to support all these companies. I have to admit if it wasn’t for a chance meeting through a friend I would of never known about water/meth, I generally believe the biggest problem is lack of knowledge on the product and lack of people even knowing it exists.

I agree Rob, but as I said water/meth isn’t going to cool the engine and oil that much, that’s not what it’s for, Even in the winter it’s not going to make oil or water temps drop below the 90 degrees and as you say that’s what the thermostats are for to control that anyways. We are talking about charge temps alone which is what water/meth is for, cooler is always better

Jay it obviously needs to be cooler otherwise there wouldn’t be mods out there such as cooler thermostats, intercoolers, oil coolers etc Just think how cold things are in countries like Russia and northern Europe I'm just bringing those countries here ; ). Anyways the block isn’t going to reduce much in temps from water/meth it’s the charge temp is the main thing we are cooling here and talking about not the block.

I agree Steve the kits are pretty much perfect and look and work lovely but the charge temps is the only thing i wanted to make better which is why I opted for the water/Meth injection as I’m already showing winter to even lower charge temps in the middle of summer with even more to come. (god only knows how lovely and cool it’ll go in the winter

They are driving skylines, Evo’s, MK4 Golfs, Focus ST’s etc Yes we are making decent power, but the issue is with a cooler charge temp we could all be making more power that is still nice and safe. Also if you look online most tuners and intercooler manufactures all talking about keeping the charge 40 degrees and under and even to the point 80 degrees is regarded as to hot and I hit 64 without even being on track or doing a hard long pull holding 5th. No one is disputing our sprintex kit and its cooling ermm I got one Lol its amazing and I love it to bits. I'm just saying cooler temps has more benefits than not. Think of it as putting ice in your favourite drink. Tastes better ..No brainer...

Steve. Before Water/Meth I was seeing peaks of 64 degrees doing fairly hard pulls (2nd-4th with a little of 5th), Now my peak is 51, on regular spirited driving I was seeing 50-55 degrees where as now on Meth 39-44 degrees. So I’m seeing a peak reduction of 13 degrees and an average of 11 degrees consistent and Bruce fills the car needs a bigger nozzle so the temps will still come down yet. So with the meth I’m staying under the timing pull and loss of power floor limit, with a much denser charge with nice High octane methanol. What I don’t get though is all my friends with turbo’s wet their self laughing at my charge temp, saying that they all stay well within a max of 6-7 degrees of ambient air temps and there peak charge temps are mid to low 30’s staying most of the time in the 20’s, yet we all on here seem happy at our 50-55??

Fruli lol

End of the day happy with it mate your happy without. Its like beer or wine both get you pissed choose your poison ; )

me Tarzan you Jane hehehe

Meth no cool off. Brake pads cheap. Engine not. Rob I hit 64 degree on road with out meth. With 51 degree then right down to 38 within a few seconds

Totally rob my post on top states this. Its fine as it is. But maybe you hit timing retard and would you do another ten laps no stop as hard? The meth will help AIT and oil temps for your entry in to btcc after your indulged racing at TSS ; )

Jay yes I've not that's because I'm mapped for high temps and with safety measures in place. For an accurate number I will have to ask mark at what charge temp does the timing pull back at and how much does he reckon it loses. Whether its 1-30 bhp its a loss jay. And more the hotter you get. But as a package the sprintex from abbey is a superb package and mapped perfectly hence no knock or detonation as its mapped safe for the temps. There is no issues with it at all. Im just stopping timing being pulled on hot temps is all. Obviously if you lift thoses safety measures its bad news jay. But to get more benefits than I already have on meth certain safety parameters can change. Just like on a pump gas / e85 blend.

Yes Griff mapping to come. But think of it as no lose is a gain. And any power you do make is a mega bonus. Let's say you have 250 whp. With meth you will always have that or there abouts. No heat soak. ECU won't retard timing due to heat or hot weather. Any weather any time you go your dyno run power. No meth you could lose (a guess) 15bhp or more due to heat soak. Now as your video says with such colder temps you can map for advance timing to produce more power more boost safer. Let's heat on charger and internal better. So what ever I can Max out at say for argument sake 40bhp I will map for 30bhp so I'm still safe. There are cons. Make sure if you select your meth map (map 3 for me) you have you meth switched on. Also make sure your topped up. But because it comes with a float switch in the tank I know when I'm down to a quarter tank as the green led will light up. That's is. For a expensive pint you got a more efficient motor and more power if any.

Griff this shoukd help explain. They don't do post charger as has been said because 1) only way to get even distribution is direct port (expensive and overkill really) 2) a lot hard more expensive to install 3) you would still have a very very hot charger heating up a engine and laminova not being cooled, so post charger by itself won't give better results.

I agree with your logic rob you are totally right. But on our power out puts just not feasible having more nozzles.as Bruce told me its over kill. If I had 400 fly then maybe. All I need is to cool the temps charger and the rest while boosting octane. This set up does that adequately. But maybe I get get better results if I went post charger but its just not worth it in our applications

JAy:- yes you are right Jay as we've both said one is ease, but also as ive already said Direct port and Pre charger (need both for best results) is overkill on a 300bhp 2.0, especially when great gains can be had from just Pre charger (look at my charge temp drops), obviously more data will come from MArk on my Remap. Personally rob I don't see the hassle. You fill up with fuel you pour in your screen wash. That's is no fuss. If you drive normally ie to work switch it off. On way way home when you fancy a trashing it or racing switch it on for full power all the time. End of the day the mix is the same price of a pint of premium beer. Rather have meth than a pint Lol well not the one ; )

Griff the reasons for pre s.c injection are all above. Most efficient way mate.